Comment 1 Andre Klapper 2009-01-22 12:39:20 UTC

Thanks for reporting this.

> SOFTWARE VERSION:
> (Control Panel > General > About product)
> Diablo (all versions)

Please take a look at Control Panel > General > About product and post the
exact string here.

> STEPS TO REPRODUCE THE PROBLEM:
> Install RTComm Beta, attempt to set up ICQ, MSN or Link-Local accounts

Please provide a step by step description. It takes more time but it makes
reproducing a lot easier.

> ACTUAL OUTCOME:
> The ICQ and MSN accounts do not go online (connection errors)

For me ICQ worked perfectly here yesterday.

Which exact rtcomm version is this about?
(Start a terminal and post the output of "dpkg -l rtcom-beta-os2008" ?)
Here it is 2.4-1.

This might be a duplicate/related of bug 3385.

Comment 2 Stephen Gadsby 2009-01-22 13:02:26 UTC

*** This bug has been confirmed by popular vote. ***

Comment 3 Alan Bruce (reporter) 2009-01-22 19:40:38 UTC

> > SOFTWARE VERSION:
> > (Control Panel > General > About product)
> > Diablo (all versions)
> 
> Please take a look at Control Panel > General > About product and post the
> exact string here.

Version 5.2008.43-7, but I (and others) have been experiencing this problem for
many months.

> Please provide a step by step description. It takes more time but it makes
> reproducing a lot easier.

As I said in the ITt thread that I linked to in my original comment:
> I had to reflash my tablet (again!) this weekend, so I had a chance to
> reinstall the RTComm beta again, too. At this point, ICQ, MSN, and Link-Local
> have problems working if you just install RTComm Beta.

To reproduce: Flash your tablet to the newest firmware. Install the latest
RTComm Beta (0.7). Attempt to get ICQ, MSN or Link-Local working. They will
not.

> > ACTUAL OUTCOME:
> > The ICQ and MSN accounts do not go online (connection errors)
> 
> For me ICQ worked perfectly here yesterday.

ICQ hasn't worked for me with unmodified RTComm Beta for many months.

> Which exact rtcomm version is this about?
> (Start a terminal and post the output of "dpkg -l rtcom-beta-os2008" ?)
> Here it is 2.4-1.

I ran "apt-cache policy rtcom-beta-os2008" and I am told that I have 2.4 0 and
that this is the version in repository.maemo.org diablo/free.

> This might be a duplicate/related of bug 3385.

Or maybe 3385 is a subset of this bug. This bug also encompasses MSN and
Link-Local.

Comment 4 Andre Klapper 2009-01-28 01:31:22 UTC

OK. "dpkg -l rtcom-beta-os2008" said 2.4-1 here. So I uninstalled it and tried
to find out what's going on here.


(In reply to comment #3)
> Install the latest RTComm Beta (0.7). 

I've never seen any 0.7 anywhere.

> I ran "apt-cache policy rtcom-beta-os2008" and I am told that I have 2.4 0 and
> that this is the version in repository.maemo.org diablo/free.

Err... that repository does not exist?!

What does exist is http://repository.maemo.org/rtcomm .
And it offers me to install version 2.4:
http://repository.maemo.org/rtcomm/pool/diablo/free/o/rtcom-beta-os2008_2.4_all.deb

Do you have this repo activated too?
If not, please provide the exact address and settings in Application Manager
for the repo you mentioned, so I can try to reproduce.


2.4-1 is available in Extras devel:
http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/diablo/free/o/osso-rtcom-beta/

Clicking on the "Info" icon it says "Status: Not installable", and in the
"Problems tab" it says:
  Unable to install rtcom-beta-os2008
  Application packages missing: osso-imlogviewer (>=0.0.4-1)
                                rtcom-profiles (>=0.4)
                                telepathy-idle (>=0.1.2-1)
                                telepathy-salut (>=0.2.0-1)

osso-imlogviewer and rtcom-profiles are available from the repo at
http://repository.maemo.org/rtcomm diablo.

Now telepathy-idle and telepathy-salut **WERE** available from
http://packages.collabora.co.uk/maemo/pool/salut/t/telepathy-salut_0.2.0-1_armel.deb
and
http://packages.collabora.co.uk/maemo/pool/idle/t/telepathy-idle_0.1.2-1_armel.deb
.

The new addresses are:
http://packages.collabora.co.uk/maemo/pool/salut/t/telepathy-salut/telepathy-salut_0.2.0-1_armel.deb
and
http://packages.collabora.co.uk/maemo/pool/idle/t/telepathy-idle/telepathy-idle_0.1.2-1_armel.deb
.

This was the old Collabora repo, but the setting does not work anymore:
   Web address  = http://packages.collabora.co.uk/maemo/
   Distribution = diablo
   Components   = haze salut idle

If anybody fingers out what to set the "Distribution" value to (empty also
didn't work for me), I'd be thankful.

Comment 5 Andre Klapper 2009-01-28 01:33:05 UTC

(In reply to comment #4)
> (In reply to comment #3)
> > Install the latest RTComm Beta (0.7). 

Ah, that installer thingy. Gotcha.

Anyway, this looks like a good mess and lots of struggle to users.
CC'ing Mikhail.

Comment 6 Mikhail Zabaluev 2009-01-28 11:14:01 UTC

(In reply to comment #5)
> Anyway, this looks like a good mess and lots of struggle to users.
> CC'ing Mikhail.

Yes, the maemo-extras effort was dropped halfway because of other priorities.
CC'ing Will: was there ever an upload of idle, salut, (and haze?) to
maemo-extras?

Comment 7 Andre Klapper 2009-02-03 14:53:05 UTC

Will: Any news? Can this be fixed soon? Seems like enough people are running
into this.

I started working on a new haze upload, but with the version of libpurple in
maemo extras (this doesn't seem to affect the same version on the desktop, for
some reason) MSN connections don't work because an untrusted certificate
warning hangs the connection process. I was working on a workaround, but
haven't had time to get it done.

(Basically I either need to add a way to whitelist certs in haze, or make API
additions in libpurple. I've had time to do neither.)

So if I upload a new haze (and update the account plugin, of course) then this
bug would be fixed, but MSN would be completely broken.

Hopefully I'll have some time to dig out the workaround branch and finish it,
then I can make new releases and make everyone happy.

I'm really sorry it's taking so long...

Comment 9 Mikhail Zabaluev 2009-02-03 16:25:45 UTC

(In reply to comment #8)
> I started working on a new haze upload, but with the version of libpurple in
> maemo extras (this doesn't seem to affect the same version on the desktop, for
> some reason) MSN connections don't work because an untrusted certificate
> warning hangs the connection process.

Is this the case of a necessary reliance on libcst to validate certificates in
Maemo 4? This is really annoying, and is going to go away in Fremantle.

I'm pretty sure libpurple doesn't use libcst; it just comes with its own set of
trusted certs. I think there's a bug in its cert checking code (if you fire up
Pidgin on Diablo, and connect to MSN, it throws a certificate error at you. But
even if you press "don't accept" it accepts it the next time around!) but I
couldn't find it when I took a brief look. On the desktop with the same set of
certs it seems to accept the relevant MSN certificate without any qualms, so I
don't really know what's going on. :(

(Hmm, my last comment confused this bug with a bug about ICQ encodings. I guess
a higher priority is to upload idle and salut, given that those packages should
work unchanged and it shouldn't take long.)

Comment 11 Andre Klapper 2009-02-04 06:17:49 UTC

*** Bug 4065 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

Comment 12 Quim Gil 2009-02-25 08:42:54 UTC

Is this really major & High?

I mean, it was a beta release and the bug is depending purely on open source
upstream components and incompatibilities in extras. Will (co-maintainer of
such components?) said he would try to come up with a fix but this is not
something that requires direct Nokia intervention.

Don't get me wrong, it is cool to have telepathy-haze integrating nicely with
Maemo and I really hope someone like to play with it in Maemo 5 as well, but
this bug is perhaps overweighted.

Comment 13 Andre Klapper 2009-03-04 01:28:05 UTC

Right...

Comment 14 Alan Bruce (reporter) 2009-03-14 01:04:13 UTC

Just a little update. ICQ changed protocol recently, and it stopped working in
RTComm Beta, even after using my method to install the needed components.

So I hacked together a package that uses libpurple0 2.5.5 components from the
Ubuntu Jaunty armel package, except for the libmsn and ssl libraries, which I
kept from the 2.4.3-1collabora1 version to keep MSN working.

Upgrading to my hacked version of libpurple0 gets ICQ and MSN online again.

New hacked package:
http://qole.maemobox.org/repository/pool/main/libpurple0-2.5.5.qole-1_armel.deb

Comment 15 Quim Gil 2009-03-24 09:58:21 UTC

Summarizing:

- No official Diablo fix at this point, and if it comes it will be basically an
upstream fix, not a Nokia delivery. In the meantime there is a community fix
that fixes the bug according to Alan.

- And what about Fremantle? Is the situation so that the RTComm framework (what
Nokia delivers) is able to handle this functionality, but the libraries need to
be provided by someone else in extras? I don't expect those Telepathy libraries
being released officially by Nokia.

Therefore... is this a WONTFIX with the hope that anyway users will benefit
from the upstream / Alan fixes?

Comment 16 Mikhail Zabaluev 2009-03-24 10:06:48 UTC

(In reply to comment #15)
> - And what about Fremantle? Is the situation so that the RTComm framework (what
> Nokia delivers) is able to handle this functionality, but the libraries need to
> be provided by someone else in extras? I don't expect those Telepathy libraries
> being released officially by Nokia.

Almost correct, except we also used to provide the account configuration
plugins.
We should decide whether we decide to support those as in-house development,
put those out as open source, or maybe open up the plugin API as part of the
SDK so that people can write their own.

In fact, it's better not be called beta any more. There is nothing we release
ahead of the product, just add-ons.

Comment 17 Quim Gil 2009-04-13 23:17:16 UTC

Resolving as WONTFIX since these protocols are not officially supported.

(In reply to comment #16)
> Almost correct, except we also used to provide the account configuration
> plugins.
> We should decide whether we decide to support those as in-house development,

As we can see with the history of this bug, it is better to leave to the
community anything that is not part of the official product. Releases in the
grey are are problematic.

> put those out as open source, or maybe open up the plugin API as part of the
> SDK so that people can write their own.

Whatever it's more feasible to be implemented in Fremantle. Also related:
whatever makes more sense with Harmattan in view. But let's discuss this in the
right place.

*** Bug 4867 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

The link in Comment 14 returns "Page not found".

What is the actual final fix and where to get it from, how to install it?

And I don't understand why Nokia would make an IM chat client which freely
supports google-talk but treats other protocols such as ICQ, MSN, etc as
"alien" or "grey" and "not part of the root package"?

Did Nokia intend to have the IM chat client officially only work with Google
Talk?

IMHO these fixes should be in official OS update, of course I'm just a
frustrated end uder, and as usual engineers think otherwise.

(In reply to comment #19)
> The link in Comment 14 returns "Page not found".

Ah, maemobox.org is dead.  See http://qole.org/files/ instead. 

> What is the actual final fix and where to get it from, how to install it?

See <http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=242652&postcount=338>.  Note that
this is a community effort, not officially supported by Nokia or anyone else.

> And I don't understand why Nokia would make an IM chat client which freely
> supports google-talk but treats other protocols such as ICQ, MSN, etc as
> "alien" or "grey" and "not part of the root package"?

Google talk uses XMPP, which is an open protocol/standard.  The others are
proprietory and likely to change without notice as you've just discovered.

Comment 21 Andre Klapper 2009-08-26 13:50:22 UTC

*** Bug 4994 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

Comment 22 Andre Klapper 2009-08-26 19:45:58 UTC

*** Bug 4994 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

(In reply to comment #12)
> Is this really major & High?
> Will (co-maintainer of
> such components?) said he would try to come up with a fix but this is not
> something that requires direct Nokia intervention.

Let Will know that this is very bad advertisement for the Nokia n810. I
personally discourage any and all clients who ask me if they should get the
device. 

The stance that google-talk is open protocol and ICQ/MSN are not, being the
reason why Nokia will not make its product seamlessly work with all in a behind
the scenes effort to make user-friendly trouble-free experience is bogus!

Why should the consumer care what is the problem Nokia is having to make IM of
all kinds work on its device? If you want to sell a product, you have to add
the service to it, that's the successful business model of 21st century. So,
make it work, don't whine why you can't!

Closed it as WONTFIX and linked a bunch of other user complain tickets to it,
you think you have a major mass-closed, but this is UNRESOLVED - SHOULDFIX. Or
basically loose clients worldwide to competition, its that simple.

Comment 24 Mikhail Zabaluev 2009-08-28 11:56:21 UTC

Should we have a clone bug for Fremantle? We are close to have it fixed there,
at least.

Comment 25 Mikhail Zabaluev 2009-08-28 12:09:41 UTC

I should remind that Nokia is under no obligation to spend resources on
unofficial implementations of third-party proprietary protocols, and there may
in fact be legal implications in doing so. This will be a community effort
(maybe with a little help from our friends, wink wink), at best.

Not having Salut in add-ons is regrettable, however.

Soo... I meant to update this bug, but forgot to. Jonny Lamb uploaded new Haze
packages to Diablo extras-devel a few weeks ago. So people testing those would
be most welcome! I can't test them myself, unfortunately: my N810 is undergoing
repair. :(

I don't remember offhand if he uploaded new Salut packages.

Comment 27 Alan Bruce (reporter) 2009-09-15 01:04:25 UTC

New packages fix MSN and ICQ, but not Yahoo for me. I know, this bug is not
about Yahoo, but it is another protocol that has become problematic recently.